Koha Ditore, Saturday, 09/01/1999

Interview to Olivier Dupuis, Secretary General of Transnational Radical Party and Member of European Parliament

RUGOVA HAS CHOSEN THE THIRD OPTION - TO DO NOTHING

Undertitle: We think, like Gandhi, that in politics you have three options: Nonviolent option, violent option and the third option, which is as far we see to do nothing. This is the one chosen by Rugova.

The leadership of Rugova has done nothing during all these years, because with passive politics, which was not active resistance, it has enabled Milosevic to create the apartheid system in Kosova.

I am a member of the Party which promotes nonviolent reaction, but we didn't see any leader in Kosova, for sure not Rugova, who would organize the population in a nonviolent resistance

Brussels, 09/01/1999

Olivier Dupuis is the Secretary General of the Transnational Radical Party and Member of European Parliament. He is known as the activist who was engaged in former Yugoslavia, in the beginning in Croatia and Bosnia, and now in Kosova and Macedonia. Few weeks ago, by his initiative, the European Parliament has approved a resolution in favour of setting free the Albanian political prisoners in Macedonia, Rufi Osmani, Alajdin Demiri, Refik Dauti etc. Meantime, he asked officially from the European Institutions the official recognition of the KLA. This three issues, and the activities of the TRP to incriminate Milosevic in the Hague for war crimes, are the essential issues that we elaborate in the interview for "Koha Ditore".

Koha Ditore: You asked the European Institutions to consider that KLA be recognized, and to start the direct contacts with KLA. What is your motivation in this demand send to the Council of Ministers and other European Institutions.

Olivier Dupuis: I think that the divisions among the Albanians are not good for them and for all the others who are supporting their course for their rights. The agreement that we have now on Kosova is not the agreement between Belgrade and Prishtina, but agreement between Milosevic and Holbrooke. Because there are no good conditions for the real dialogue between Albanian side and Belgrade, the agreement Milosevic-Holbrooke is likely not to succeed. During the last ten years in Kosova we have seen that the leadership of Rugova and the LDK leadership was not in the position and able to create the necessary conditions to find the solution, now we have the new factor and that is the KLA, which has the clear vision and expressed what they want. I think that the KLA demonstrated and explained their position and that KLA has to be considered as very important in the political process.

Koha Ditore: When you say that KLA have clarified their positions in their demands, do you think that Rugova have not clarified the same?

Olivier Dupuis: The leadership of Dr. Rugova made a lot of mistakes, and accepted all these years the abuses of fundamental human rights in Kosova, without any reaction from the political side of so-called parallel and underground institutions, they left Milosevic sending out the Albanian workers, closing Albanian schools and building the system of apartheid in Kosova. There was no concrete opposition from the Rugova policy towards Milosevic policy. The policy that Rugova has chosen is not the policy of active nonviolent resistance towards Milosevic policy, but was the passive resistance which left Milosevic the open doors, which after ten years left Albanians without any rights. I am from the party which promotes the nonviolent reaction, but we didn't see any leader in Kosova, for sure not Rugova, which would organize the Albanians in nonviolent resistance. After this, after ten years, some Albanians in Kosova have decided to create a new factor of resistance, resistance by force against the repression. We

think, like Gandhi, that in politics there are three options: nonviolent option, the option by force, and the third option, which was followed by Rugova, and that is to do nothing. Even Gandhi was of the opinion that where is no option of nonviolent resistance it is better to follow the option of violent resistance rather than the option to do nothing, you have to choose the first one, because the option "to do nothing" is the most dangerous one.

Koha Ditore: You have explained that some Albanians have decided to resist by using the force, but the self defense is not the act of the violence.

Olivier Dupuis: After all, there are the elements of the violence.

Koha Ditore: After all you are representative of the Transnational Radical Party, are you of the opinion that is too radical to ask the recognition of the KLA, at the time when the European institutions and other international organizations are trying that both sides have to share the responsibility and in some cases they are afraid to recognize the fact that the KLA is present?

Olivier Dupuis: In that case they like to recognize the way that Milosevic likes to serve to them. He is always saying that KLA is terrorist organization, which I think is absolute mistake, because KLA is an army which is formed from the people who are fighting against the repression and the aggression from which lot of them are killed and expelled from their own houses. Those people, that means KLA, like to organize themselves in the way that the people were organized before in Sarajevo, Vukovar, Osjek, Dubrovnik, and other cities in the former Yugoslavia. I think that European institutions have to reckon the fact that there are the people that are organizing themselves for self defense and to them we have to give legitimate.

Koha Ditore: These days, Mr. Demaci was in Tirana, he met with Meidani, Prime Minister Majko, and Paskal Milo. Looking the fact that Mr. Rugova didn't meet this Albanian leaders for long time, there is the opinion that Rugova slowly is out and the KLA is openly supported from the Albanian political scene.

Olivier Dupuis: We have to wait and to see the results of these meetings, but I hope that the people outside Kosova, in Albania, in Europe, and USA, understand that giving no recognition of KLA it means to support Milosevic's policy.

Koha Ditore: You said some words about the agreement between Milosevic and Holbrooke. Now is publicly known that this agreement didn't exist in the written document, but as an oral agreement.

Olivier Dupuis: You are right, because nobody saw this agreement, or just American administration knows about this agreement.

Koha Ditore: What is your comment about the fact that EU is supporting this agreement? Are you of the opinion that they are supporting an agreement without knowing what is written.

Olivier Dupuis: What is incredible is that the Europeans do not have a foreign policy, one policy. EU, is not able to speak with one voice, EU is not able to decide, EU is not able to put the pressure or to impose the solution about Kosova, just like in Croatia or Bosnia, or in the future about some other problems. Europe is running the policy not to have problems, and this is why Europeans are not ready in front of the problems. EU must immediately have one unique foreign policy, because speaking with 15 voices you cannot resolve any problem. We, as a federalist party, are in favour of the European Union in the sense that the right to veto cannot exist if it paralyse all other institutions or the problem.

Koha Ditore: Once the Americans accused the Europeans that in the case of Kosova they are not doing anything, some MEP accused USA that they are helping Europeans to "do nothing" in Kosova. Which is your position on American policy towards Kosova ?

Olivier Dupuis: I think that Kosova issue is linked with Bosnia and the Dayton's agreement, that's why Holbrooke is the strong man of American policy in Balkans. After all Holbrooke is not the only voice in the American administration, but he has a "deal" with Milosevic.

Koha Ditore: You are thinking about a kind of agreement such as "Don't mess with Kosova if you want peace in Bosnia" ?

Olivier Dupuis: On one hand is like that, because the name of Holbrooke is linked to the Dayton's agreement and the USA don't want to jeopardize this agreement. On the contrary, I think that the Americans and the UE, have to rethink about this agreement because this agreement is not working in a good way, and in fact it is bringing out the division of Bosnia. We have to face this reality and to find some other solutions.

Koha Ditore: You mentioned another of your Party's initiatives that is related to the International Tribunal of war crimes in former Yugoslavia. You have started the initiative for the indictment of Milosevic. How is the Tribunal reacting till now?

Olivier Dupuis: They are doing everything they can, but the main problem of the Tribunal is that the war criminals Karadzic and Mladic are still free, as well as the main organizer of the crimes, Milosevic, is free and he is acting in Kosova in the same way that he acted in Croatia and Bosnia. The problem is that USA and UE have to support the Tribunal.

Koha Ditore: Do you think that the Tribunal do not have enough political support?

Olivier Dupuis: In one way the Tribunal have the support, but at the same time some politicians, in USA and EU think that Milosevic is the solution for the problem and not the problem itself. Until this politicians play the game of Milosevic, it is very hard to start the procedure against Milosevic.

Koha Ditore: How you are satisfied with your action of collecting the signatures for indicting Milosevic. There are information's that you have more than 100.000 signatures. Do you think that this petition have enough effects ?

Olivier Dupuis: I hope, but I think that this is not enough. We hope to have more signatures in Kosova, although this is not so easy. The Albanians have to know that the fight for Kosova cannot be reduced just to the arm resistance, they have to be engaged also in the political fight. I think that is also in the interests of the Serbian nation, that the national communist regime of Milosevic have to fall, and to give also to the Serbs the chance to build the rule of law and democracy. The Serbian nation under this regime cannot build democracy.

Koha Ditore: Perhaps you will disagree, but we have to come back to the theory that every nation have the leadership that it deserves. Serbs since ten years want to live under Milosevic's regime.

Olivier Dupuis: I think that his regime is dictating the rules of the game, and that he is not giving the chance to other alternatives, he crushed all students' initiatives inside Serbia. The situation is the same as it was in Germany under Hitler. During the time that Hitler was in power, he killed all efforts to democratize Germany. The same in Serbia.

Koha Ditore: Do you see any other alternative in Belgrade, because the Serbian opposition, in some cases, is even harder then Milosevic himself as for Kosova.

Olivier Dupuis: I think that Serbia has other better leadership. Serbia had a very important place in the european history, now Serbia is a situation without perspectives, the main problem is to put down Milosevic, who has brought the nation at the stage of a disaster. Milosevic is choosing the nationalistic leadership and he is throwing out the democrats, in this way he is playing his game, the opposition and the Serbian nation unfortunately are not moving.

Koha Ditore: Your resolution calling on the Macedonian authorities to set free the Macedonian political prisoners has been recently approved by the EP. This resolution has caused several reactions inside the Macedonian political scene. How do you react to the different opinions on the Macedonian political scene.

Olivier Dupuis: I have to add that all the EP has strongly supported this resolution. I am satisfied with the positive reaction from the prime minister Georgijevski. We have information about the veto of Gligorov about the amnesty law in Macedonia, which was approved by the Parliament of Macedonia. I think that the new government that started to lead the new policy in the interethnic relations was positively surprised, because the project of the law for the amnesty was the concrete step, and this government has shown not only to be able to speak but also to act at the same time.

Koha Ditore: How you see the future in the political life in Macedonia, because now, in power, are the two "extreme parties" as they were considered before, Arben Xhaferi's and Georgijevski's ...

Olivier Dupuis: I don't like this kind of analyze, because the two parties in the governmental coalition are working in a good way and they are not divided by the ideology. I hope that the EU will support clearly this government.